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Thanks to all who have replied to this. I agree wrt IQ and what exactly is it. My further searches have come up with several surveys, one of which looks at Math and shows thAt the poorest performers in Japan still achieved more than the best in US (or so the summary says). I haven't read the actual report as yet: IEA Second International Maths Study, 1986 A similar result was found in 1989, with Korea coming out top (whatever that means!). If anyone is interested in further details let me know and I'll post direct. Ken Spencer firstname.lastname@example.org